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Toddler Death Law Suit Update

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Just now, S.A.M.J.R. said:

According to the poster I quoted, the lawyer is saying the ONE released is at a "deceiving" angle.  But there's been two released.

 

I HIGHLY doubt there are 13 cameras that cover that corner of the deck.  There might be 13 cameras on the pool deck, or even in that 1/3 of the deck, but there's no way there are 13 cameras looking at the same space. 

 

There are cameras that record the outside of the ship from many different angles.  I do not know if 13 is the actual number of cameras that could have recorded this incident, but I am sure not all of them are looking at the corner of the deck, many are looking at the other side of this accident.

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7 minutes ago, KelSny1011 said:

 WOW..I didn't know that. Do you know if RCI ever tried to settle with the family?  

 

RC has had their videos the whole time... no reason for them to settle... from their statements they were just being politely quiet until pushed too far with the bad faith law suit and bad mouthing from the family/attorney.

 

If the stepGF had taken the plea deal then that would have put a serious crimp in the lawsuit and the grasp for $$$.

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8 minutes ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

According to the poster I quoted, the lawyer is saying the ONE released is at a "deceiving" angle.  But there's been two released.

 

I HIGHLY doubt there are 13 cameras that cover that corner of the deck.  There might be 13 cameras on the pool deck, or even in that 1/3 of the deck, but there's no way there are 13 cameras looking at the same space. 

 

5 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said:

 

There are cameras that record the outside of the ship from many different angles.  I do not know if 13 is the actual number of cameras that could have recorded this incident, but I am sure not all of them are looking at the corner of the deck, many are looking at the other side of this accident.

 

https://nypost.com/2020/01/19/video-shows-grandfather-dangle-chloe-wiegand-before-fatal-fall-on-cruise-ship/

 

This is one if the articles that references the 13 cameras.  Not saying I agree with the attorneys at all.  Agree they are just grabbing at straws trying to come up with anything at this point, time to let it all go and drop this silly lawsuit.

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1 minute ago, akcruz said:

 

 

https://nypost.com/2020/01/19/video-shows-grandfather-dangle-chloe-wiegand-before-fatal-fall-on-cruise-ship/

 

This is one if the articles that references the 13 cameras.  Not saying I agree with the attorneys at all.  Agree they are just grabbing at straws trying to come up with anything at this point, time to let it all go and drop this silly lawsuit.

 

Thanks for the link.  Really no way of knowing what they are considering "in the area" but I am sure that there are many distant cameras that have some glimpse of the whole incident, whether it is just showing them walking to the area or cameras on the outside of the ship showing the entire fall and more.

 

There is more than the two that have been released and I hope none of them ever get released to the public.

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I was trying to think of a way to hedge this question without it being morbid but I don't think there is a way. There are also cameras that are trained on the outside of the ship. Wouldn't it seem that there is most likely video from outside looking toward the window?

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3 minutes ago, akcruz said:

This is one if the articles that references the 13 cameras.  Not saying I agree with the attorneys at all.  Agree they are just grabbing at straws trying to come up with anything at this point, time to let it all go and drop this silly lawsuit.

 

I've been on juries and I believe that if too many camera angles are shown, the jury will become "overwhelmed with info". If 11 of the 13 (or whatever) cameras barely show anything or don't show anything clearly "....these three pixels are Mr. Anello...", the jury will tune them out. Even if the final 2 videos are the 2 that most of us have seen, the jury might be brain dead at that point. The attorney is hoping that by claiming "...RCCL isn't showing all angles because they are trying to hide something...", a potential juror will side in favor of the family. 

 

18 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said:

There are cameras that record the outside of the ship from many different angles.  I do not know if 13 is the actual number of cameras that could have recorded this incident, but I am sure not all of them are looking at the corner of the deck, many are looking at the other side of this accident.

 

I'm fairly certain that there is a video of what happened outside. RCCL really wants to avoid releasing anything that shows the impact(s) but I'm willing to bet that there is video taken from the outside that shows Anello's head and upper body outside and shows Chloe being held outside.

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I would think the Port would have multiple cameras, however this is Puerto Rico so camera condition might not been kept up with since the disaster.  

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2 minutes ago, Two Wheels Only said:

 

I've been on juries and I believe that if too many camera angles are shown, the jury will become "overwhelmed with info". If 11 of the 13 (or whatever) cameras barely show anything or don't show anything clearly "....these three pixels are Mr. Anello...", the jury will tune them out. Even if the final 2 videos are the 2 that most of us have seen, the jury might be brain dead at that point. The attorney is hoping that by claiming "...RCCL isn't showing all angles because they are trying to hide something...", a potential juror will side in favor of the family. 

 

 

I'm fairly certain that there is a video of what happened outside. RCCL really wants to avoid releasing anything that shows the impact(s) but I'm willing to bet that there is video taken from the outside that shows Anello's head and upper body outside and shows Chloe being held outside.

 

If you have ever taken a bridge tour, you can see the monitors showing the different cameras recording the outside of the ship, there will be many videos.  There will also be other angles, like a camera on the outside promenade deck, that also have some video of the incident.

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The lawyer claims there are 13 cameras "in the area", not that there are 13 cameras pointed at the window where the accident happened.  These interior cameras are mostly not pan/tilt movable cameras, so if they aren't pointed at the specific area, they won't show anything.  I would be surprised if there were more than 2-3 cameras that showed a close/medium range view of the area around the window.

 

The cameras along the side of the ship are of the pan/tilt type, and frequently, when in port, are pointed and zoomed in close on the  gangways, so these may or may not show anything.

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4 minutes ago, taglovestocruise said:

Puerto Rico authorities must have some good evidence if they have charged the GF with manslaughter. 

I believe the charge is negligent homicide, not manslaughter, unless it has changed.

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4 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

I believe the charge is negligent homicide, not manslaughter, unless it has changed.


Nothing has changed, it's still negligent homicide, which is appropriate for the circumstances.

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1 hour ago, taglovestocruise said:

Puerto Rico authorities must have some good evidence if they have charged the GF with manslaughter. 

Not everybody charged with a crime is convicted. In those cases I think the charging   D.A.s thought they had good evidence too. Unless I’m missing something, it is still innocent until proven guilty.

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I still don't see this ever going to court.  Too much risk for Royal, no matter how much the evidence is on their side.  You just never know with a jury.  A juror or 2 who don't like big corporations and want to root for the little guy...a juror or 2 who also had a personal tragedy and can sympathize with wanting to blame Royal...one good (or potentially confusing) argument from the Plaintiff's attorney that makes a connection with a couple of jurors...etc.  If Royal can't get the case dropped, I think they will settle somehow, likely with no admission of guilt.  Guessing that's what the Plaintiff's lawyer, and maybe the family, are betting on. 

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5 minutes ago, bobmacliberty said:

I still don't see this ever going to court.  Too much risk for Royal, no matter how much the evidence is on their side.  You just never know with a jury.  A juror or 2 who don't like big corporations and want to root for the little guy...a juror or 2 who also had a personal tragedy and can sympathize with wanting to blame Royal...one good (or potentially confusing) argument from the Plaintiff's attorney that makes a connection with a couple of jurors...etc.  If Royal can't get the case dropped, I think they will settle somehow, likely with no admission of guilt.  Guessing that's what the Plaintiff's lawyer, and maybe the family, are betting on. 

 

 I think this will happen also.  There comes a point, where it is better to settle than to continue to fight. We will never know the terms or how much was awarded, but it will be cheaper for RC than to continue to fight.  

As far as the GF, he has a life sentence even if he will never admit to doing something so stupid. 

 

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It's a sad situation where nobody will win.

 

Anyone who has cruised even once on these ships knows it's near impossible to not realize a window is open, especially if you've taken the time to lean out the window.

 

To hold your granddaughter outside a ship for over 30 seconds is reprehensible. 

 

To then claim the cruise line is in any way at fault is irresponsible.

 

Again, nobody will win but there is absolutely no reason for Royal to admit any fault nor settle any claim with this family. The incident was wholly the fault of the grandfather. That won't bring back the child or ease the family's pain, but it is, what it is. An entirely avoidable situation.

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3 hours ago, twins_to_alaska said:

 

 

If the stepGF had taken the plea deal then that would have put a serious crimp in the lawsuit and the grasp for $$$.


That is exactly why I think he won't accept a plea deal.  It would tank the parents' already sinking case.  The GF held that poor little girl out a window.  An accident would have been holding her up to the window and her lunging forward.  Holding her out the window is a deliberate negligent act that nobody in his or her right mind would ever do with a toddler.

Edited by TNcruising02

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It is pretty obvious to me that Royal will fight this.  Releasing the statement was unprecedented for a large corporation being sued.  

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21 hours ago, akcruz said:

For all those on this thread that are insinuating that in any way this was an intentional act by the GF, I strongly disagree and really dislike seeing such accusations.  While I do believe the GF is solely responsible for this child's death I find it very hard to believe there was anything intentional here.

 

HOW do you know that???????

 

Most have stated that it is a POSSIBILITY.  Not that it was definite thing.

 

You find it hard to believe, because you are a reasonable person.  There ARE some very bad people in the world.

 

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1 hour ago, SRF said:

 

HOW do you know that???????

 

Most have stated that it is a POSSIBILITY.  Not that it was definite thing.

 

You find it hard to believe, because you are a reasonable person.  There ARE some very bad people in the world.

 

Maybe one in a zillion chance? There is absolutely not a bit of information anyone to believe this, unless maybe then had tendencies themselves.

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9 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

Maybe one in a zillion chance? There is absolutely not a bit of information anyone to believe this, unless maybe then had tendencies themselves.

 

We had a local incident years ago where a grandmother intentionally dropped a toddler from a pedestrian bridge at a local shopping mall.  No signs at all in advance that made anyone concerned.  Again, you only get what news makes it into an article, never first hand, and who would ever say "I had concerns but I still let them watch my child?" after the fact?

 

While I don't think this incident was intentional, I rarely rule it out.

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Parents seem to now be saying it is physically impossible for the GF to have leaned out the window. I am 5'3" and if I tried I could get my shoulders past the window frame. Not sure what they are trying to say about his feet needing to be 7" off the floor 🤷‍♀️

 

David Begnaud the reporter is 5'9". Anello appears to be taller than him in their interview....

 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/ct-nw-royal-caribbean-cruise-ship-death-chloe-wiegand-20200123-2nmrsz3pnvbgjoi5ge7zmd3pqe-story.html

Edited by JennyB1977

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10 minutes ago, JennyB1977 said:

Parents seem to now be saying it is physically impossible for the GF to have leaned out the window. I am 5'3" and if I tried I could get my shoulders past the window frame. Not sure what they are trying to say about his feet needing to be 7" off the floor 🤷‍♀️

 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/ct-nw-royal-caribbean-cruise-ship-death-chloe-wiegand-20200123-2nmrsz3pnvbgjoi5ge7zmd3pqe-story.html

 

The family's rebuttal includes a statement the shows that GF was in violation of the Passenger Code of Conduct.

 

"He told “CBS This Morning” in November that he was trying to stand Chloe on the window’s railing when she plunged from the open window.

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