Freedom Venues Vaccinated/Unvaccinated Rules Spelled Out

[zekekelso]

54 minutes ago, Moltar said:

 

Pittsburgh is just 369 miles from NYC. Have you lost your mind? That's like asking them to make a port stop to Pittsburgh.

Don’t be ridiculous*. Why would anybody leave New York to go to Pittsburgh?

* read with your best Balki voice

[Itchy&Scratchy]

52 minutes ago, Thenagers said:

I have a friend whose children did the vaccine trial. She is a doctor at Duke. She believes it will be available before school starts for the next age group. I don’t know how you feel about that but at least it is an option. 

our school starts a month from now. We'll see.

[harkinmr]

1 hour ago, Thenagers said:

RCL is trying to have unvaccinated kids not unvaccinated adults. Notice the places that are vaccinated only. Kids can’t go anyway. Plus kids are exempt from the extra testing fees. Honestly Carnival is a mess as well. They are having a lottery for unvaccinated spots for kids and no kids clubs. Personally I wouldn’t take my kid on either until all this is sorted out. I feel sorry for families that really want to cruise. I’m taking my teens but they are vaccinated. 

If RCI wanted to only have unvaccinated children, they could do the same thing they are doing in Nassau. Anyone over eligible age needs to be vaccinated. Do what Celebrity is doing and ask and expect voluntary submission of vaccination proof at boarding. You can have a larger percentage of unvaccinated kids if you want. Florida law does not preclude RCI from asking all adults to be vaccinated.  I know families are having a tough time with these current restrictions, but maybe cruising needs to wait for them. Especially for parents who really aren’t ready to accept the risks.  There are other vacation options for families right now. 

[forgotmyCCname]

53 minutes ago, Merion_Mom said:

 

The reference was to OTHER lines, not RC.

Thank you, ma'am!

[livingonthebeach]

2 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

If RCI wanted to only have unvaccinated children, they could do the same thing they are doing in Nassau. Anyone over eligible age needs to be vaccinated. Do what Celebrity is doing and ask and expect voluntary submission of vaccination proof at boarding. You can have a larger percentage of unvaccinated kids if you want. Florida law does not preclude RCI from asking all adults to be vaccinated.  I know families are having a tough time with these current restrictions, but maybe cruising needs to wait for them. Especially for parents who really aren’t ready to accept the risks.  There are other vacation options for families right now. 

 

I don't think FL law will interfere with anything cruising at the moment.  It's not the state's top priority to go after cruise lines for asking for proof of vaccination status. In the wake of the Surfside building collapse, there are other things more pressing.  I live 4 miles north of that site and can tell you all lawmakers' hands are on deck there now. 

[Tolkmit]

1 hour ago, coffeebean said:

But......those who refuse to be vaccinated can very easily change their category by getting themselves vaccinated. It is an individual decision and of course, there will be categories. How can there not be categories? Being in the un-vaxxed category is proving to be the undesirable category so why not transition into the desirable category? That's how I see it.

 

I think my point is being confused, so I clearly didn't express it very well. They are, by definition, discriminating against the unvaccinated, and I'm pointing out people saying otherwise are just factually incorrect. However, there is nothing inherently wrong with discriminating. It's a perfectly natural thing. Discriminating against someone based on certain, specific things is illegal. This isn't one of those things. I have absolutely no problem with the cruise lines treating unvaccinated passengers differently than vaccinated passengers. Yes, it is by definition discrimination. And that's perfectly ok.

[broadwaybaby123]

Looks like I'd be all set for the most part.  I'm vaccinated, but my niece (who's coming with me) is too young to receive the vaccination at this point.

[ReneeFLL]

7 hours ago, Itchy&Scratchy said:

….So, needless to say - I am torn. It's already a risk to cruise with an unvaccinated child, but when the cruise line itself limits the already vulnerable kids to the areas with unvaccinated adults and teens only - the risk increases. 

At the same time, we haven't had a vacation in 2 years, thanks to covid. This cruise was L&S... We really want to cruise, and we are even willing to wear masks indoors.

Why take the chance with a cruise if you are concerned about your child? Isn’t his health more important than a cruise? There are other vacations and you can cruise later.

[OSUZorba]

4 hours ago, coffeebean said:

Because children are un-vaccinated too. I do not get your POV at all.

You don't understand why people don't like kids that have no choice in not being vaccinated being forced to be surrounded by adults that have chosen to put those around them at a higher risk? The adults have chosen to take high risks with theirs and other's health, why give them targets with children?

 

To be clear, I don't mind kids having higher restriction than vaccinated adults. But it isn't right to force unvaxxed kids into the same spaces as unvaxxed adults (MDR, Shows, Excursions, etc). If they want to make a unvaxxed adults section far away from the unvaxxed kids section, fine.

Edited June 29, 2021 by OSUZorba

[coffeebean]

11 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

///

 

11 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Celebrity can not dance around it.  They chose not to do test sailings; they can not leave the dock unless the unvaccinated count s 5% or less.

Royal went the test sailings route and this option squarely falls on the Florida law. The CDC had no option but to mandate the safety protocols they did if unlimited un-vaxxed people are on board a cruise ship. I get it but,iIf there were no Florida law that bans requiring proof of vaccine, Royal would have to abide by the 95% vaxxed rules like the other cruise lines have decided to go with. 

 

I cannot deny it is good to offer choices to people and Royal is offering this choice to un-vaxxed people. Having said that, I will not ever sail on Royal as long as vaccinated people have to mask up anywhere on their cruise ships. I diligently masked up in all indoor spaces for well over a year but being fully vaxxed now, I'm so over that. I will not, under any circumstances, mask up on vacation on a cruise ship just because there are more than 5% unvaxxed people on board. That ship can sail without me.

[3kidsncats]

8 hours ago, zekekelso said:

Such a shame no cruise line docks in Vegas. Would make for a great day in port. I guess it’s because the ships don’t want competition for their onboard casinos. 

That would be a neat trick

[3kidsncats]

7 hours ago, zekekelso said:

Like that would stop the cruise lines from docking in Long Beach and calling it “Vegas.”

Lots of ships dock in Long Beach/San Pedro, but never seen any line try to pretend it’s Vegas.  Pretend it’s LA, yes.  Vegas, no.

[Biker19]

17 minutes ago, coffeebean said:

That ship can sail without me.

What if masking is imposed after you leave the dock? 

[coffeebean]

11 hours ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

 

That's interesting. Our cards have no stamp whatsoever. Of any kind. I think this is nothing but a CYA scare tactic. I'm not saying they may not try,  but they could not prove any type of fraud w/ the card we were issued. No signature and no agency stamp of any kind.

A cruise line could get the inoculation records from health departments. IMHO, everyone, at registration, should sign a consent form stating that a cruise line may obtain inoculation records. Period! If there is any question that the vaccination record  that was presented at registration is forged, the cruise line can and will obtain inoculation records from health departments.

 

I'm a resident of Florida, you know.....the state that has banned vaccine passports. Yes, THAT state. LOL. I asked my PCP to obtain my inoculation records from the State of Florida Health Department. I had a copy of my records by the following day and to my utter surprise, all my vaccinations are recorded with the State of Florida. They even have my vaccinations when I was a child as a resident of New York State. My inoculation record contains the name of my Covid vaccine, the dates of both injections and the location of both injections.

 

So.....proving forgery would be extremely easy when the cruise lines have the written consent of every single passenger at registration who presents proof of vaccination, for them to obtain inoculation records. Anyone who is presenting a forged vaccination document/card, just may not be willing to sign a consent form for the cruise line to obtain such records. Ah ha!!! Dead give-a-way that the proof they have is a forgery. I would imagine this could work to seek out those forged vaccination documents/cards.

 

 

 

Edited June 29, 2021 by coffeebean

[coffeebean]

8 hours ago, rtazz17 said:

We get it. Dont sail then. But stop constantly saying it and guessing how everyone else feels about something. 

There is no guessing involved. Many people, myself included, have been saying over and over and over and over how we feel about Royals protocols for vaccinated people. I will not subject myself to Royal's protocols. I will sail on other lines who are following the 95/100% vaxxed passengers on their ships. NO protocols to deal with is the way I like it.

Edited June 29, 2021 by coffeebean

[sgmn]

13 hours ago, harkinmr said:

I said they can be infected and they were.  I also believe they can transmit the virus.  I understand they tested close contacts and they tested negative, but incubation periods run 2 to 14 days and early testing does not always accurately reflect infection, particularly antigen tests.  As you said, they are not following anyone after the cruise so we will never know whether anyone else was infected.  It sounds like your experience on the cruise with children was different from others on that cruise and the first one who said they saw many children unmasked at various points.  It doesn't really matter.  Protocols should be enforced ship-wide and I still contend that the risk of infection of unvaccinated children is on the parents, not the cruise line.  It will be an even greater risk with larger groups of children and unvaccinated adults on board.  I guess that was the point of my post.

Its still possible to catch this delta variant even after two doses , just not so easy I guess and the illness isn't usually life threatening 

This is a article by one of our most well known political journalists who caught it after two doses of Pfizer vaccines.

Interestingly he had two lateral flow tests, both which were negative.

 

BBC News - Marr on catching Covid after being double vaccinated
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57640550

 

 

Edited June 29, 2021 by sgmn

[Babr]

8 hours ago, Tolkmit said:

 

I think my point is being confused, so I clearly didn't express it very well. They are, by definition, discriminating against the unvaccinated, and I'm pointing out people saying otherwise are just factually incorrect. However, there is nothing inherently wrong with discriminating. It's a perfectly natural thing. Discriminating against someone based on certain, specific things is illegal. This isn't one of those things. I have absolutely no problem with the cruise lines treating unvaccinated passengers differently than vaccinated passengers. Yes, it is by definition discrimination. And that's perfectly ok.

There are people here who have gone to great lengths to claim that it is in fact unjust. If you don’t mean it in that sense, perhaps you could say that they are making a distinction between groups for the purpose of mitigating a public health threat.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Babr

[Thenagers]

8 hours ago, harkinmr said:

If RCI wanted to only have unvaccinated children, they could do the same thing they are doing in Nassau. Anyone over eligible age needs to be vaccinated. Do what Celebrity is doing and ask and expect voluntary submission of vaccination proof at boarding. You can have a larger percentage of unvaccinated kids if you want. Florida law does not preclude RCI from asking all adults to be vaccinated.  I know families are having a tough time with these current restrictions, but maybe cruising needs to wait for them. Especially for parents who really aren’t ready to accept the risks.  There are other vacation options for families right now. 

They actually are asking for vaccine status. I got the survey for my July 26th sailing. It asked if we were vaccinated and willing to share.  I am hoping enough people have canceled to get us to a magic number? As far as the Bahamas sailings they have been sailing at about 94 percent vaccinated but since not in US don’t have to follow CDC guidelines. The kids in those ships have to wear masks but I don’t think that was strictly enforced until the 2 teen issue last week. I agree that it just might not be the time for a family vacation but I think a lot of families have already paid/planned for this. Not everyone has enough money to pay for 2 vacations so they just have to not have one or go anyway. I feel for the families. I actually don’t have much sympathy for the people complaining that could get vaccinated. 

[Thenagers]

10 hours ago, forgotmyCCname said:

North Carolina seems to have been quite on the ball. One of my kids had his vaccines in NC at college- maybe he'll be lucky!!

They are giving out 4 1 million prizes! Plus 4 scholarships for the 12-17 age group!

[tinkertwo]

10 hours ago, Evilgrin72 said:

 

Exactly this. Couldn't agree more. What's confounding to me is that they seem to think that families and unvaccinated passengers will flock to them and happily wear masks. Now maybe I'm wrong and that other guy is right and I'm misreading the market, but I'm not sure I've heard one person say that they were sailing and more than happy to wear masks everywhere. Everyone I've heard say they were already booked seem to be of the opinion that it won't be necessary by the time they sail or that it won't be enforced. 

Maybe that's Royals hope, that people who are unvaccinated will be so put off with having to wear a mask that they just won't come.  Then they aren't the bad guys because the option is out there. 

We are vaccinated and have a B2B booked for in a few months time.  I'm sitting on it right now but we are thinking that we will move it to Sept 2022 and just wait to see how everything goes.   

[orville99]

RCL just sent us the protocols for our August Allure cruise out of PC, and have updated their website to detail the protocols for all of the ports where they are currently (or will soon be) cruising.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/the-healthy-sail-center/getting-ready-to-cruise

[Babr]

15 minutes ago, orville99 said:

RCL just sent us the protocols for our August Allure cruise out of PC, and have updated their website to detail the protocols for all of the ports where they are currently (or will soon be) cruising.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/the-healthy-sail-center/getting-ready-to-cruise

Was the proof of insurance always there or is that part of the updated plan?

[OSUZorba]

12 minutes ago, Babr said:

Was the proof of insurance always there or is that part of the updated plan?

Pretty sure it's new.

[Babr]

7 minutes ago, OSUZorba said:

Pretty sure it's new.

I don’t remember seeing it before, but there was a post about it yesterday. I was wondering if I had somehow overlooked it.

[sandebeach]

9 hours ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

I don't think FL law will interfere with anything cruising at the moment.  It's not the state's top priority to go after cruise lines for asking for proof of vaccination status. In the wake of the Surfside building collapse, there are other things more pressing.  I live 4 miles north of that site and can tell you all lawmakers' hands are on deck there now. 

Not to be off topic but the Surfside collapse is so tragic. My thoughts go out to all affected.  And yes, I have noticed that the press conferences include a lot of the Florida elected officials. Cruising is not a priority right now in Miami-Dade County.